Has anybody sucessfully run either 4.2 or 3.3 using Q? I keep getting disk errors. Which drivers should I use?
I'm assuming Q = Qemu?
Quote from: "stevebez"Has anybody sucessfully run either 4.2 or 3.3 using Q? I keep getting disk errors. Which drivers should I use?
Look thru the threads here in the subforum. You'll see you need to apply some patches to the qemu source to get everything working properly. I use OPENSTEP 4.2 daily under OpenSolaris. I've also compiled Q for OSX and tested it.
Quote from: "kb7sqi"Look thru the threads here in the subforum. You'll see you need to apply some patches to the qemu source to get everything working properly. I use OPENSTEP 4.2 daily under OpenSolaris. I've also compiled Q for OSX and tested it.
Any chance of getting a pre-patched copy from you? I'm compiler stupid.
Also, qemu would be much faster than VPC5, right?
Quote from: "stevebez"Quote from: "kb7sqi"Look thru the threads here in the subforum. You'll see you need to apply some patches to the qemu source to get everything working properly. I use OPENSTEP 4.2 daily under OpenSolaris. I've also compiled Q for OSX and tested it.
Any chance of getting a pre-patched copy from you? I'm compiler stupid.
Also, qemu would be much faster than VPC5, right?
Yes, qemu even without the cpu driver is FASTER than vpc5...
I've had too many people try to hack vaxenrule.com so I don't have a good place to place binaries, but if you know of a place to host stuff, I can upload patchsets & fully built versions.... We aren't talking that much space...
Directory of C:\NeXTSTEP
06/02/2008 12:14 AM 130 ns.cmd
05/17/2008 07:56 PM 35,328 vgabios-cirrus.bin
05/17/2008 07:56 PM 37,888 vgabios.bin
05/17/2008 07:56 PM 131,072 bios.bin
06/07/2008 02:41 PM 966,691 qemu-img.exe
05/17/2008 02:37 AM 1,723,602 SDL.dll
05/30/2008 10:32 AM 5,617,555 qemu-rhapsody.exe
05/25/2008 01:25 PM 5,621,789 qemu-90.exe
06/07/2008 05:07 PM 5,772,933 qemu-snap.exe
08/03/2008 07:42 PM 1,498,329,088 ns33.disk
version 0.9.0 runs fine under Vista64, as do the later snapshots, but the mouse code is going to be 'involved' so I've just been hoping the next version will release soon...
Quote from: "stevebez"Quote from: "kb7sqi"Look thru the threads here in the subforum. You'll see you need to apply some patches to the qemu source to get everything working properly. I use OPENSTEP 4.2 daily under OpenSolaris. I've also compiled Q for OSX and tested it.
Any chance of getting a pre-patched copy from you? I'm compiler stupid.
Also, qemu would be much faster than VPC5, right?
Which would you like x86 or ppc? :-)
Quote from: "kb7sqi"Quote from: "stevebez"Quote from: "kb7sqi"Look thru the threads here in the subforum. You'll see you need to apply some patches to the qemu source to get everything working properly. I use OPENSTEP 4.2 daily under OpenSolaris. I've also compiled Q for OSX and tested it.
Any chance of getting a pre-patched copy from you? I'm compiler stupid.
Also, qemu would be much faster than VPC5, right?
Which would you like x86 or ppc? :-)
PPC please! I don't think my tiBook would like the x86 version much.
Quote from: "stevebez"Quote from: "kb7sqi"Quote from: "stevebez"Quote from: "kb7sqi"Look thru the threads here in the subforum. You'll see you need to apply some patches to the qemu source to get everything working properly. I use OPENSTEP 4.2 daily under OpenSolaris. I've also compiled Q for OSX and tested it.
Any chance of getting a pre-patched copy from you? I'm compiler stupid.
Also, qemu would be much faster than VPC5, right?
Which would you like x86 or ppc? :-)
PPC please! I don't think my tiBook would like the x86 version much.
Ok, I'll post the PPC version on my site in the misc section later after work. :-) I'll update the post when I do get it uploaded. Take care.
How about the ultimate agony:
Load vpc5 on a beige G3 running 10.2
Run qemu x86 under vpc5
Run os 4.2 under that
Sounds like good times!
Quote from: "stevebez"How about the ultimate agony:
Load vpc5 on a beige G3 running 10.2
Run qemu x86 under vpc5
Run os 4.2 under that
Sounds like good times!
That sounds like truly painful experience. ;-) Ok, sorry for the delay, but my weekend got messed up w/ work. You'll find a gzip'ed Q dmg file in the misc section on my site. It's about 6.6 megs compressed. It's for PPC only and has neozeed's QEMU patches applied. I've tested it w/ NEXTSTEP 3.3 & it supports the color video & the mouse works. If you're planning on running it on a beige G3, I'll warn you, it's going to be SLOW. :-( I compiled it on one my spare iMac's running Tiger 10.4.11. Should run on panther also though. Let me know how it works for ya. Take care.
Thank you very much for your help so far, but it "no worky". The program launches fine, but when I go to start the virtual machine I get "qemu unexpectedly quit, library not loaded". Any ideas?
Quote from: "stevebez"Thank you very much for your help so far, but it "no worky". The program launches fine, but when I go to start the virtual machine I get "qemu unexpectedly quit, library not loaded". Any ideas?
Can you run it from the command line & see what it's trying to load? What version of Mac OSX are you running also? It's built on Tiger, but should run on Panther also.
Quote from: "kb7sqi"Quote from: "stevebez"Thank you very much for your help so far, but it "no worky". The program launches fine, but when I go to start the virtual machine I get "qemu unexpectedly quit, library not loaded". Any ideas?
Can you run it from the command line & see what it's trying to load? What version of Mac OSX are you running also? It's built on Tiger, but should run on Panther also.
The only way to run it from the command line that I know of is to use the open command. Doing so gives me no extra information.
I'm running 10.4.11 on an 800 mhz tiBook.
Quote from: "stevebez"Quote from: "kb7sqi"Quote from: "stevebez"Thank you very much for your help so far, but it "no worky". The program launches fine, but when I go to start the virtual machine I get "qemu unexpectedly quit, library not loaded". Any ideas?
Can you run it from the command line & see what it's trying to load? What version of Mac OSX are you running also? It's built on Tiger, but should run on Panther also.
The only way to run it from the command line that I know of is to use the open command. Doing so gives me no extra information.
I'm running 10.4.11 on an 800 mhz tiBook.
I'll re-compile it again. Just to make sure.
If QEmu uses SDL, maybe he doesn't have SDL installed.
I don't know if it matters, but the "regular" version of Q runs fine, except for NS/OS.
Quote from: "openstepjunky"If QEmu uses SDL, maybe he doesn't have SDL installed.
What is SDL? Are you referring to xtools?
"Simple DirectMedia Layer". It's a crossplatform api/toolkit a lot of games and stuff use.
I know this is an old thread. I got the version of Q working from kb7sqi. It was compiled with dependencies. You need to install MacPorts - libpcap in the /opt/local/lib directory first.
Brian
Hello Brian!
could you provide us with detailed instructions on how to install libpcap?
i just tried it myself, but failed. i do not have experience in such things.
on which system are you running q? my system: iMac G5 with 10.5
it would be really great, if you shared your knowledge of how to get this custom version of Q running with us.
thanks a lot!
Andreas
Andreas,
Schöne Grüsse aus Hawaii.
The version of LIBPCAP that is installed by MacPorts has a different name than the version that Q is looking for. What you need to do is create a symbolic link to LIBPCAP so that Q can find it.
cd /opt/local/lib
sudo ln -s libpcap.a.dylib libpcap.dylib
That should do it. If you still have issues, use the preferences in Q to display output to the Console. Then use the Console to track down the error.
I hope this helps,
Brian Moore
brian, thanks a lot for this information!
you lead me into the right direction, but the dynamic link wasn't 100% correct.
i found out the requested filename via console. just type into terminal:
sudo ln -s libpcap.a.dylib libpcap.0.dylib
now the installation process of nextstep 3.3 is running, hope everything goes well!
Update:
NeXTSTEP 3.3 now works properly. I have installed the video driver from "
http://www.nextcomputers.org/NeXTfiles/Software/NEXTSTEP/Drivers/nextstep_3.3/released/CL_GD5434.pkg.compressed". (download file, make an mac os standard disk, 1,4 MB with disk utility, unpack file in os x, copy package into image file, load image as cd in nextstep, then install package)
configure.app recognizes the driver, i chose 2 MB mode. the only mode that seems to work is
1024 x 768, 75 Hz, 16 bit color depth (which is great)
next i am going to try setup networking and sound!
if anyone has an idea how to set up internet an network, please post the procedure.
with soundblaster, there seems to be a conflict with the busmouse. anyone got an idea?
Andreas,
I do not currently have Q running, so I am going from memory.
1. The next higher color resolution in 16-bit color worked on my G4 Powerbook. I think it was 1132x864 or something like that.
2. You can use the standard 16-bit soundblaster driver that comes with NeXTSTEP. You just need to set the Soundblaster IRQ to 7 in Configure.app. This version of Q was compiled to use IRQ 7 for the soundcard so it will work.
3. You can use the NE2000 driver for the networking card. I think I found it on the files section of this web site.
4. I never did figure out how to configure Q for bridged networking. So even though my VM was properly configured, Q didn't forward network requests.
5. I never did figure how to get Q to change the host resolution to match the VM resolution in full screen mode. That would have been nice to have.
Again, good luck. It should run very nicely on a G5 Power mac once you get it configured.
Brian Moore
i tried setting up sound as you described it, but when nextstep starts up, it just makes a little clicking sound. after that, sound in nextstep does not work and os x's sound is also brocken. (just clicking noises, itunes, etc does not make any sound, restarting resolves the problem in os x)
i could not find the ne2000 driver, but i think setting up network may become a bit too difficult for unexperienced people like me.
Andreas,
I'm going to try to build a slightly better version of Q for NeXTSTEP with all the patches. My initial goals are to build a universal binary version, incorporate all NeXTSTEP patches, remove dependencies for MacPorts libraries, and tweek the network settings for bridged networks. I make no promises on any timetables when I'll get this done. I have several projects.
The other project I'm researching is writing a NeXTSTEP 3.3 video driver for Parallels 4.x. If anyone else is working on this already, please let me know so I don't duplicate any efforts.
Mit freundlichen Grüssen,
Brian Moore
thanks a lot! i think there are many people here, interested in such an improved build of Q
I am getting smart on Q:KJU and its underlying command-line utility Qemu. That being said I don't have a viable patch for the current 0.9.1 snapshot of Q. What I do have is a patch for the current Qemu 0.9.1 SVN Trunk. A lot of thanks to "Madd The Sane" from the Qemu forums for his help. I have managed to get the patch to install and to build a working version of Qemu.
Note, however, that Qemu has changed a lot since Q was released. In order to get Q to use the SVN head of Qemu, a lot of work needs to be done. Work that, unfortunately, is beyond my knowledge. Hopefully Mike Kronenberg will update Q when Qemu releases the next version, which isn't going to be long. At that point, it should be possible to adapt the patch for Q.
I have posted the patch on my public folder at:
http://public.me.com/bkmooreSome basic instructions to building and installing Qemu on Mac OS X.
1. Get the Subversion Package utility at:
http://homepage.mac.com/martinott/2. From the command prompt download the current Qemu source code trunk current revision 669)
svn co svn://svn.sv.gnu.org/qemu/trunk qemu
3. Copy the files: applesmc.c busmouse.c lpc.c from the patch into the /qemu/hw/ sub directory
4. Copy the file currdiff.diff into the /qemu/ directory
5. run the patch utility:
patch -p0 < currdiff.diff
6. Look for errors where the patch failed to apply. I had to go back and add the the following lines to the Makefile.target. You can do a search for .rej (reject) files to find where the patch might not have applied.
OBJS+= lpc.o applesmc.o
OBJS+= busmouse.o
7. Configure the target:
./configure --disable-sdl --disable-aio --target-list=i386-softmmu
8. Build and install the application:
make all
sudo make install
A not of confession. This is as far as I got. I downloaded a miniature linux image to test Qemu and it worked. I then converted my Q NeXTSTEP 3.3 image (.raw) format to a Qemu image, but I am still having issues with the mouse after booting.
Here's what I did:
qemu-img convert -O raw Harddisk_1.raw NS33.img
Then I made some symbolic links to help Qemu find all its components:
ln -s /usr/local/share/qemu/vgabios-cirrus.bin ./vgabios-cirrus.bin
ln -s /usr/local/share/qemu/bios.bin ./bios.bin
Then I used the command line to boot:
qemu -L . -m 32 -hda ns33.img
Hopefully someone here can see where I went wrong, or can tell me what steps I still need to take. I have a working OpenSTEP VM in Parallels, so I am doing this side project more as a public service.
Very Respectfully,
Brian Moore
what are the advantages over the existing version of Q?
Hi Brian,
It's good to see "Madd The Sane" is still keeping patches for Qemu. :-) Ok, I tried the "current" svn code + patches on OpenSolaris first. Qemu-0.90 runs flawlessy for me. I dug out my test NEXTSTEP 3.3 image, compiled it & you can see the results on my web site. They don't look good. Something is causing the system hang on boot up. It's late & time for bed, so it's a battle for another day personally. The proper way to start up the system w/ the "current" patches applied is like this:
qemu -M nextpc -m 128 -hda ./ns33.img -k en-us -localtime -soundhw sb16 -net nic -net user
Notice the -M nextpc & the -k en-us. If you don't include those, the busmouse won't work & the keyboard won't work properly as well. :-) I'll give it another shot possible later after waking up on OSX. It's 0410 here now, so I'm beat. Here's the screenshots btw:
http://kb7sqi.dyndns.org/files/screenshots/qemu.test/New.Qemu.Test.1.pnghttp://kb7sqi.dyndns.org/files/screenshots/qemu.test/New.Qemu.Test.2.pngBTW, andreas_g, normally newer=better. ;-) The newer versions of qemu support more hardware, have quite a few bug fixes over 0.90 and also somewhat faster. I'll have to dig the last svn check out I did a while back. It still worked. I'll let you know after sleeping. :-) Take care.
kb7sqi,
Thanks for the "launch code." I tried it out and NS3.3 booted right up in full color and glory with all drivers working! I posted a screen shot proof in my public folder
http://idisk.mac.com/bkmoore-Public?view=webBrian
Quote from: "bkmoore"kb7sqi,
Thanks for the "launch code." I tried it out and NS3.3 booted right up in full color and glory with all drivers working! I posted a screen shot proof in my public folder http://idisk.mac.com/bkmoore-Public?view=web
Brian
Hey Brian,
So I got some sleep. :-) Rebooted my laptop back into Tiger & tried to compile. It fails because of the patch to cocoa.m file. No problem, copied the archive over to my tiny Dell Mini9 running Leopard. ;-) It compiled fine. Like your results, the first time I booted it up, it came up in full glory. After a reboot though it fails like it did on OpenSolaris. Same results. In fact, that's all I get now. Right after lookupd is when I get them. :-( Can you try several reboots & see if you get the same results?
Steven,
I don't seem to be having any issues with booting. I was able to reproduce your bug the one time I did a config=Default start up. It hung trying to load all the network daemons.
Issues I've had so far are:
1. mouse only seems to support single button. I tried enabling right button and both buttons wound up being the right button.
2. bridged networking not working for me. I am confident my NS3.3. network settings are OK. Problem must be with QEMU
3. significant amount of video tearing in full screen mode.
If you have any thoughts on any of these, please let me know.
Brian
This is all very exciting to watch! I'd love to be running NS in a virtual machine on my desktop. I am eagerly awaiting all of your results!
Quote from: "bkmoore"Steven,
I don't seem to be having any issues with booting. I was able to reproduce your bug the one time I did a config=Default start up. It hung trying to load all the network daemons.
Issues I've had so far are:
1. mouse only seems to support single button. I tried enabling right button and both buttons wound up being the right button.
2. bridged networking not working for me. I am confident my NS3.3. network settings are OK. Problem must be with QEMU
3. significant amount of video tearing in full screen mode.
If you have any thoughts on any of these, please let me know.
Brian
Hi Brian,
Besides the problem on boot which I see more on OpenSolaris, I'm seeing these issues also. Especially the networking. I'd have to say the latest svn release isn't quite ready for prime time yet as far as NEXTSTEP/OPENSTEP is concerned. 0.90 is rock solid. But I'll mess w/ it more this week as I have time.
Quote from: "dai_vernon"This is all very exciting to watch! I'd love to be running NS in a virtual machine on my desktop. I am eagerly awaiting all of your results!
dai_vernon,
There's several ways to already run NEXTSTEP/OPENSTEP virtually that do work well besides the latest svn version of qemu. If you're running Mac OSX, VMWare Fusion 1.1 & even 2.0 run both NEXTSTEP/OPENSTEP well. You run in to problems w/ 2.0.1 though. Once you have the drivers installed/working, everything works 100% even sound. Parallels 3.x runs OPENSTEP really well also. In fact, it's the fastest way to run OPENSTEP under Mac OS X. Only thing that don't work is sound. When running OSX, this is how I prefer to run OPENSTEP virtually. VirtualBox upto 2.0.6 also runs OPENSTEP well, it's just slower than all other ways mentioned above. Everything works like VMWare Fusion/patched version of qemu. Just not as fast. Since I run OpenSolaris most of the time, I tend to use the older version of qemu over VirtualBox, but since VirtualBox runs on so many platforms, I also use it. It's nice to be able to use the same "virtual" images on each system. Search thru the forums here, we've tried to cover all this as much as possible. :-) Hope that helps. Take care.
Thanks for the advice, but unfortunately VMWare isn't an option because I am a) poor and b) using a PPC mac. I have had some success with non-nextstep stuff under qemu with linux and I would prefer using it for this too. When I get more free time I will likely try qemu + nextstep on linux. I already have GNUstep running on my debian server. It's pretty nice but I'd love to try the real thing!
Quote from: "dai_vernon"Thanks for the advice, but unfortunately VMWare isn't an option because I am a) poor and b) using a PPC mac. I have had some success with non-nextstep stuff under qemu with linux and I would prefer using it for this too. When I get more free time I will likely try qemu + nextstep on linux. I already have GNUstep running on my debian server. It's pretty nice but I'd love to try the real thing!
Hey, there's nothing wrong w/ wanting to use a "free" alternative. The patches to qemu-0.90 work great for running NEXTSTEP/OPENSTEP. Last year I did a comparision of "NXBench" running "virtually" & against real hardware that I run. I put the screenshots on my websever. It's gives you an idea how everything faired. :-) Running things "virtually" is great when on the go, but I still prefer "real" hardware. ;-) If you want to build a system on the cheap, I'd pick up an old Sparc 4, 5, 10, or 20 off Ebay/Craigslist or pick up the parts & build an older x86 box for cheap. :-) The old HP gecko's also make really nice NEXTSTEP systems. I love all my older systems. Take care.
I'll be getting an 040 cube in april and am really excited at the prospect of running NS 3.2 natively, especially on one of my favorite machines ever, but I think everyone here can understand wanting to delve into NS on modern hardware.
Does anyone has a patched OSX x86 binary release with qemu 0.10.2 ?
i am also highly interested in an updated version of the customized q (universal binary + bug fixes)
Quote from: "oneNeXT"Does anyone has a patched OSX x86 binary release with qemu 0.10.2 ?
I tried 0.10.2 & a svn release around the same time w/ patches proved by CW, aka MaddTheSane. I didn't have any luck getting it to be stable though. I have haven't had time to work on it again though. I'd like to upgrade to 0.10.2 myself, but 0.9 is still rock solid for me when running OPENSTEP 4.2 under OpenSolaris. When I get a chance to work on it again, I'll post my results. Take care.
