NeXT Universal Soundbox Replacement: NU_IO

Starting a new thread with a new name. I present the NeXT Universal IO: NU_IO (New I/O)



Features:
nonADB keyboard support (supported on all systems)
ADB Keyboard support (on supported systems: only turbo models)
B&W VGA Video (on supported systems: no NS Color or Color Turbos, existing Y cable OK)
Stereo sound (supported on all systems)

The board is built around an original NeXT ASIC = 100% compatibility. I found a cache of NOS chips which should be put to good use!

Besides the new name I did some clean up and added some mounting holes for custom enclosures. I also removed the separate mono amp figuring an internal stereo jack is good enough.

Rob (blackhole) has several boards already which use the older ASIC (from recycled printers) which include sound. These are functionally equivalent. Support for that ASIC has been dropped in this design due to space constraints. I wanted to keep the board simple and within the footprint of the original soundbox.

Enjoy:

Beyond Awesome , no more chasing printer ASICS ? I'll sell out the current inventory . It would be interesting to plug Drakwares usb to non adb adaptor in I'll try a Wombat here .  Adding USB  would provide a solution to no NeXT keyboard or NeXT Mouse or NeXT Soundbox :)

Sweet! Where do I send my money?  :)

WOW!  A new NeXTcard in 2019!  That's amazing and a testament to just how awesome the machine WAS and still IS!

Bravo!

Am I correct in thinking that this can be used to replace a missing/broken soundbox on a TurboColor setup?

An external powered speaker would still be needed correct?

Quote from: nextchef on October 23, 2019, 05:29:31 PMAm I correct in thinking that this can be used to replace a missing/broken soundbox on a TurboColor setup?

An external powered speaker would still be needed correct?

Yes, this can be used to replace any soundbox configuration. A turbo color means you can choose between ADB or nonADB using the same board. External speakers required.

Are you saying this can not be used in an existing soundbox using the built in internal speaker now that it no longer has the separate mono amp?

Quote from: nextchef on October 24, 2019, 11:15:02 AMAre you saying this can not be used in an existing soundbox using the built in internal speaker now that it no longer has the separate mono amp?

Not as-is. It could easily be added back. Just use one of these and match the pin names labeled on the board:

https://www.adafruit.com/product/3006

You can see in the image above that it does have an inward facing stereo jack that functions as well. The main problem is the new board won't fit without cutting the enclosure for the new ports. I would discourage modifying existing soundboxes at this point. 

Yes I would not want to cut up an original soundbox to make this fit, especially when 3D printed versions are available.  Have you given any thought to a custom case to enclose this?  Perhaps something more in the design of the nextstation itself since this does not need space for the speaker.

Unfortunately 3D design is not in my current skillset. Hopefully someone else can step up and help us out.

The complete batch of ASICs came today still in the original reel packaging:

Got a reasonable supply of amplifiers today. I have gotten several PMs about these. I will do a limited run of these for forum users. Price will be $110 each plus shipping via paypal. Remember if you want to use this with a cube, you must have a 935 power supply. If you have the 152 power supply you need the "megaload" board I also designed. I can include one for an additional $30. I will not sell the megaload separately. I will use some time around the thanksgiving holiday to make these, so please let me know if you're interested soon.

Hi Brian.  I'm interested in getting two of these (unless the supply is short, in which case one is fine, as I wouldn't want to shut anyone else out).  I don't find any way to PM you, which I imagine has to do with my lack of post history.  I made my account here a number of months ago, when I got my Cube (which actually you did some work on), but haven't posted anything yet, so here we are.  :)

Regarding the PSU, my Cube has a 983 power supply.  Will this work without the megaload?

I have a little bit of 3D design experience, although I am far from a master.  If no one else has come up with something, I'll be happy to work up a case design after I have a board, and of course share all the files for anyone else to tweak and customise.

Quote from: Theta-K7 on November 01, 2019, 05:13:38 AMRegarding the PSU, my Cube has a 983 power supply.  Will this work without the megaload?

Yes, this will work without a megaload. The 983 was designed for use with a soundbox.

My real limitation is time at the moment, but I don't mind sending multiple units.

Just to clarify, I won't be taking payment until the boards are ready to ship. My next problem is to find appropriate sized shipping boxes.

Hello Brian: USPS small flat rate boxes will work well ! You can always throw a flew envelope over them as well .  So I know your wheels are turning , what other things can be created with those NeXT ASIC Chips?  A modern NITRO or Pyro accelerator perhaps ?  I have a bunch of original sound box shells that warped in for lack of a better explaination , we've been taking a gander at using a dremil tool along the base also for cubes pehaps a custom slat to house the card with in the cube case, then we would be able to 3d print a custom bezel to match your encarnation masterpieces of sound cards. I lowered the price on the first rev series one cards and will list the series 2. I can send you a few shells if you want to tinker with the idea.  Peace Rob

So, this gives me a modern replacement for my NeXT monitor?  I have only B&W NeXTs (a prototype Cube and 3 stations), and I'm sure my monitors are dead at this point.  (I probably need to re-cap all of the systems as well.)  Does this board allow me to use all of my existing hardware, replacing the original B&W monitor with a modern VGA monitor?  Am I getting this right?

Quote from: eagle on November 06, 2019, 08:13:15 AMSo, this gives me a modern replacement for my NeXT monitor?

That is the idea, yes. Plug it in just like you would a megapixel and have access to keyboard/sound/vga.

That's very cool.  Are you planning another run at some point in the future, or is this a now-or-never thing like the Atari Incognito was (until Lotharek made a run of them last month, first time in 10 years) ...

Thanks.

Quote from: eagle on November 07, 2019, 08:30:59 AMThat's very cool.  Are you planning another run at some point in the future, or is this a now-or-never thing like the Atari Incognito was (until Lotharek made a run of them last month, first time in 10 years) ...

Thanks.

I will probably make some extra units. Longer term this will likely turn into a kit build with just the board and ASIC supplied.

What resolution do you get on the VGA display?  1132x820?  1280x1024? Something else?

Quote from: eagle on November 10, 2019, 02:02:10 PMWhat resolution do you get on the VGA display?  1132x820?  1280x1024? Something else?

The VGA monitor should do 1280x1024 to accommodate the native 1120 x 832 resolution.

Brian, please put me down for one board.  I've had a Nextstation sitting on a shelf for years because I haven't had a soundbox.  It will be great to get it up and running finally.

Hi, please put me down for a board as well.

All I have the following NUIO orders:

Forum Users:
Theta-K7      2
Bushnrvn      1
Eagle         1
Nextchef      1,  +1 MegaLoad
oneNeXT       2
Mattsoft      1
Andreas       2
Scarecrow     1
Msch           1

Email Orders:
Luciano D.    2
Sven O.       1
Olav F.       1

Please let me know if you want to adjust the quantity, or if I have missed anyone on the list. I will be closing the order window as of Friday. 

Progress:



Now I need to do testing. Hopefully I can be ready to ship all of them in 1-2 weeks.

For sure I will need to do a kit version going forward. These take an unreasonable amount of time in quantities to do by hand. Making a couple dozen has given me the following thoughts/insights for the next revision.

1) I am making the DB19 connectors by hand. You will see variance in the part as a result (Fit, color). For the next revision I will need to set the port back a couple mm to account for this variance.  This is also time consuming and will likely be a source your own part for a kit.
2) Small mask changes: Align the direction of the part markings
3) I like the look of the black solder mask, but it's really hard to clean. I'm undecided.
4) I am considering changing the layout to use surface mount passive components. I could then have the board house populate these parts. It would add upfront cost, but when you consider an assembler needing to purchase 10 separate parts, it might be less than the shipping. This would significantly decrease the amount of time required to build the board. Further it removes the need to sort individual components if making a complete kit. My original thinking was to keep the soldering skill requirement as easy as possible. Thoughts?

It looks like the small flat rate USPS boxes are the way to go. The board fits with some extra room for padding.

Small update. I've been delayed on testing because unfortunately a batch of 74LS04's turned out to be counterfeit. I had to rework the boards to remove them.

Another thing I want to clarify. If you want to use ADB Keyboard/mouse (this includes Apple branded, which is nice) on a turbo system you MUST have the 3.3_v74 ROM installed. For this run I can supply one freshly programmed in the package if requested ($10). I will not sell them individually.

I have a NeXTStation Color and a NeXTStation mono. Do You recommend to upgrade the ROM to 3.3_v74 here too?

Quote from: msch on December 19, 2019, 04:12:17 AMI have a NeXTStation Color and a NeXTStation mono. Do You recommend to upgrade the ROM to 3.3_v74 here too?

If these are max. 32MB RAM models you can't upgrade. You have to stick with 2.5 v66.  If these, Turbo and non-Turbo have the new chipset with max. 128MB you have to do so.

Merry Christmas everyone! Boards are finished, tested, and packed. Please send me a PM with your email, physical address, and phone number if outside the US for customs. I will bill through paypal. I would like to ship in a single batch the first weekend of January, so please try to respond reasonably quickly. As a reminder I will be using the USPS small flat rate box. It is only a flat rate within the US ($7.90). For everyone else, you can calculate the shipping prices here:

https://postcalc.usps.com/

2 cards fit in a single box. I will be shipping from 94043.

Paypal invoices just went out. If you didn't get one please contact me.

All,

I'm very sorry, but I need to delay shipment by 1 - 2 weeks. I have found that my clock circuit is not stable on a small number of the boards. Researching this, I have found that my choice of a logic gate based clock generator was a poor decision and they are notoriously flakey. As the gates age, heat up, and between manufacturers there is enough variance to cause intermittent issues. My initial batch of 7404s were all rock solid, but I've had mixed results with my recent batches (including some flat out fakes). All of this makes me very uncomfortable sending these out without a fix. I found a proper oscillator and can rework the existing boards with new part. I'll do my best to turn the fix around ASAP. 

No worries, better safe than sorry! Thanks for the update!

Hello Dave,

thank You for the update and for Your engagement!

Thanks for the update and no worries here.

Amazing how prevalent counterfeit/fake components are out there, even from supposedly reputable supply houses.

Hi Brian, Thanks for the update.
I'm in no hurry, take the time you need to complete this beautiful project  8)
Luciano

Are there any of these left for purchase? I'd be really interested in buying a couple.

Update: All boards are reworked and tested. I will repackage throughout the week and get them shipped ASAP. Thanks all for your patience.

Update: US orders go out Friday. For Europe I need to wait for customs envelopes which should arrive in 3 - 5 days.

Got my tracking number - thanks!

I got a very special package today.  Now to pull out a NeXT and plug it in and see what it does. :)

Thanks!

Got mine too but haven't had a chance to try it out. My retro corner of the house is covered up during remodel construction. BOOOO!!!!

My retro corner is piled high with a dead Atari 800XL, an Atari 800 that needs some work, an Atari 5200 that only displays black & white for some reason.  I'm sensing a trend.  I also recently picked up an IBM PC 5150 that I want to test out.  The NeXTs are in the closet at the moment -- I just didn't want to miss out on this very important piece of hardware. :)

Just chiming in with a confirmation that I've received my NU_IO.  I look forward to having time to try it out, whenever that is lol.

Thanks for all the hard work and the contribution to the community.

Update: Customs envelopes came in. I'll have the rest of the cards shipped by next weekend.

Update: I have shipped all remaining orders. Please let me know if you have not received a shipping confirmation. All US orders should have arrived by now. Thank you everyone for your patience.

There have been a number of requests for an additional batch. I will do one more run to make sure everyone here is taken care of. Unfortunately the price needs to increase a bit to offset the cost of the new crystal.

NUIO - $115 (only $5 more)

I would ask that you send a new PM to let me know your interest so I can create a new spreadsheet. I will close orders by the end of February with expected shipping by the end of March.  For reference the shipping in the US is a flat ~$8 and the shipping to Europe has been ~$40. 2 boards can fit in one box.

Has anyone in Europe received their board yet?

Quote from: barcher174 on February 22, 2020, 04:14:54 PMHas anyone in Europe received their board yet?

Mine's waiting for pickup at the post office.  I just haven't been able to grab it yet.  :)

My orders from the US are still waiting at customs clearance process...

QuoteYour item is being processed by customs in GERMANY at 1:03 am on February 21, 2020.

In Germany it takes a long time (up to three weeks) to go through customs...

The package arrived in Frankfurt on February 11, since then it is stuck at customs...

The next step is ,,customs clearance complete" - after that the customs will handle over the package to the transport delivery service / DHL.

Quote from: msch on February 23, 2020, 12:53:19 AMMy orders from the US are still waiting at customs clearance process...

In Germany it takes a long time (up to three weeks) to go through customs...

The package arrived in Frankfurt on February 11, since then it is stuck at customs...

The next step is ,,customs clearance complete" - after that the customs will handle over the package to the transport delivery service / DHL.

Mine is on: Your item is being processed by customs in GERMANY at 12:52 am on February 21, 2020.

The board arrived today - thank You Brian!

P.S.: Attention megaload board customers: do not bend the legs of the halogen bulb too much to avoid cracking...

Quote from: barcher174 on February 22, 2020, 04:14:54 PMHas anyone in Europe received their board yet?

Brian, is there any news for my two boards?
Thanks!
L.

Quote from: Andreas on February 23, 2020, 02:37:21 PMMine is on: Your item is being processed by customs in GERMANY at 12:52 am on February 21, 2020.

Arrived, thanx Brian

Quote from: krazycat on March 02, 2020, 11:55:42 AMBrian, is there any news for my two boards?
Thanks!
L.

Will be shipped on Saturday.

Update, I think I almost have enough boards built/tested to accommodate everyone who has expressed interest. Please PM your address and paypal email so I can send invoices.

Various life events (some of them actually good) and a failure to realise that a new customs policy had taken effect here meant that it took a really long time for me to finally get my hands on my NU_IO cards, but I did finally pick them up yesterday.  Everything looks to be in working order.  Thanks Brian!

Brian, is there any news for my two boards?
Thanks!

Quote from: oneNeXT on March 19, 2020, 09:07:06 AMBrian, is there any news for my two boards?
Thanks!

Can you PM your shipping address/phone number? I need them for the paypal invoice. Boards are ready to go.

Also note there are closures and travel restrictions in my area due to the virus (I am healthy). This will delay shipment.

Quote from: barcher174 on March 04, 2020, 11:40:25 AMWill be shipped on Saturday.

Finally my boards have arrived too! (A component has been crushed but I hope everything works).
Now It's time to have some fun! Thanks a lot!

Quote from: krazycat on March 23, 2020, 08:12:33 AMFinally my boards have arrived too! (A component has been crushed but I hope everything works).
Now It's time to have some fun! Thanks a lot!

Oh no! Can you post a pic of the damage before powering up? Everything is easily replaced except the ASIC.

Quote from: barcher174 on March 23, 2020, 12:45:25 PMOh no! Can you post a pic of the damage before powering up? Everything is easily replaced except the ASIC.

Mail sent with photos. Thanks for any suggestion!

I just sent out a batch of paypal invoices for those who have expressed interest. If you did not receive an invoice it's likely because I did not get a shipping address for a quote. Please contact me ASAP so I can batch ship and limit my trips to the post office.

FYI: I am almost out of 19pin female connectors. Please keep your eyes out for a source.

Quote from: barcher174 on May 16, 2020, 12:27:25 AMFYI: I am almost out of 19pin female connectors. Please keep your eyes out for a source.

https://www.exxoshost.co.uk/atari/store2/#0084

You should probably talk to him personally if you want more than a few.  I know that the Atari community needs these as well.

Thanks!

Shipping confirmations should have gone out via paypal. I will drop them off tomorrow. I have also ordered 20 more 19pin connectors. The price for future orders will need to increase a bit to compensate.

New price list:

NU_IO - $120
MegaLoad - $30 (not sold separately)
ADB Compatible ROM for turbo machines - $10 (Not sold separately)

Estimated shipping for USPS small flat rate box (Can contain 2 boards):
USA - $7.95
Europe/Asia - $40.00

Design Update:

A forum user here did a waveform comparison and found that the sound output was slower than expected. ~30% slower. It turns out to get cycle accurate sound we need to use a 11.2896mhz crystal. I also tested with 12mhz which is a much more common value (cheaper). There is a noticeable speedup, but it is more in line with what is expected. So interestingly the new  ASIC increased the clock frequency going in. The previous value works as expected for the 1st revision ASIC. So if you find this annoys you, I recommend you replace the oscillator with a 11.2896mhz 5V part.

Do You have a source for the part?
Is it possible to use a 2 pin oscillator or do we need the dip-14 type?

This one should work:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vanguard-TCXO-0-1ppm-11-2896MHz-Ultra-precision-Golden-Oscillator/131020886729?hash=item1e817412c9:g:TLsAAOxygLxSXZA0

A 2pin crystal will not work without additional components.

As an update, I am in talks with a factory in china to produce a batch of these.

Great, Thumbs up!

11.2896Mhz is works fine to me. I use prescaled 22.5792Mhz with 74HC74.

Quote from: yusukeito on July 12, 2020, 03:44:17 AM11.2896Mhz is works fine to me. I use prescaled 22.5792Mhz with 74HC74.

Great! I received my order for packaged oscillators and everything is working on my end too with the new parts. 

I have a Turbo Color that needs one of these.

It is a bit off-topic but maybe still the right place to ask:

Does anyone know at what frequency the soundbox reports mouse events to the system (via interrupt)? It would also be helpful to know what values are usually reported for mouse motion events.

Are these still available? If they are I would love to order one.

-Magnus

Yes, Rob Blessin has them in stock.

Quote from: barcher174 on August 16, 2021, 04:13:16 PMYes, Rob Blessin has them in stock.

That's Black Hole, right? I can't find them on his webshop. I'll send him an email.

-Magnus

you can also try to contact him via eBay-store
https://www.ebay.com/str/blackholeinccomputerpowwownext?_trksid=p2047675.l2563 (https://www.ebay.com/str/blackholeinccomputerpowwownext?_trksid=p2047675.l2563)

First of all, thank you so much @barcher174 for making these!

Does anyone know of a project box that's easy to mount one of these in? I don't need it to "look fancy" just "keep dust and my cats away from it" :)

Quote from: pergamon on October 17, 2021, 10:44:25 AMFirst of all, thank you so much @barcher174 for making these!

Does anyone know of a project box that's easy to mount one of these in? I don't need it to "look fancy" just "keep dust and my cats away from it" :)

Have a look at these:

http://www.nextcomputers.org/forums/index.php?topic=4514.0

Quote from: Nitro on October 17, 2021, 02:04:46 PMHave a look at these:

http://www.nextcomputers.org/forums/index.php?topic=4514.0

Yeah those are gorgeous but what I was trying to avoid waiting/paying for :). Hoping there's a stock box from somewhere I can use, I'll keep looking!

Hello !

New here and i found it because of the NU_IO.

Where can i get one ?

Nice thing, can save me from the death of my two sonys...

Any chance these are still being built? Ive had an amazing Next system but unable to use it because I need to find something like this :)

- Mark

Rob has some listed on ebay right now.

Hello !

Tried to find them - but no luck.

NU_IO and worldwide search gave me no links here at germany.

Do i need to log in in USA for that ?

best regards

Found the eded auction ow, will try to get one next time.

thanks for the link.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/275116129284?hash=item400e32fc04:g:bmsAAOSwbTRhqaCg

Thanks guys  :) Orders in!

Quote from: barcher174 on January 24, 2022, 01:48:56 PMhttps://www.ebay.com/itm/275116129284?hash=item400e32fc04:g:bmsAAOSwbTRhqaCg

The eBay listing is gone. Is there another place they are available?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/284949471197?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=5Wnb35VxQYK&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=d8v2RuZ5SO2&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

Does this support any monitor with VGA or only a sync-on-green monitor?

Are you hooking it up to a NeXT Mono station or Cube or a NeXT Colorstation ?

SoG is not required for B&W machines. The VGA port on this device only works with B&W units. The color signal needs to be split off with a y cable.

Thanks. I have a mono NeXTStation so this sounds great.

Hi all,
Getting a little late on this topic
Does anyone know where can I get a soundbox replacement now?
Interested in a DIY kit too.

Any suggestions or help would be welcome!

Hi all, new to the forum.

Does anyone have one of these for sale? Desperately hoping either Brian or Rob are doing another run of these so I can get my (new to me) cube running :)

I think I'd need a 'megaload' board too as my machine is an earlier Next Computer rather than NeXTcube.
 


Thanks!

I would also be very interested in picking one of these up for my NeXTStation.  Even in kit form this would be great, probably just need the PCB and NeXT ASIC.

Hello everyone,

Following up on this topic, if there are any available for sale I would like a megaload version as I have one of the older Cube

Well, I still don't quite understand it, but it turned out to be the monitor.

I'm trying to use the NU_IO with my NeXTstation, and I'm a bit confused with some of the behavior I'm seeing. I have a later rev mono slab that has ADB support. I'm using the NU_IO with a Y cable I got from Rob Blessin. When I hook it up with a standard Apple ADB keyboard and mouse, it works fine. For purely aesthetic reasons I'd like to use it with a black keyboard and mouse. Since black ADB keyboards of any sort are even rarer than NeXTs, I thought I'd use a Wombat to adapt a USB keyboard and mouse. But when I attempt to use the Wombat with the NU_IO, I lose the video. I get nothing but a smeared grey image. I can't understand why a different ADB device would affect the video. Any ideas?