Title: LuBu OpenMagic: Openstep 1.1 on Solaris 10
Post by: itomato on October 22, 2006, 04:24:01 PM
Post by: itomato on October 22, 2006, 04:24:01 PM
Just installed LuBu OpenMagic on my Ultra 10.. Running Firefox, WorkspaceManager, Acrobat Reader 7, GIMP, Mail.app (oops - Mail.app is b0rken..), et cetera - all happily together!
http://freshmeat.net/projects/openmagic/
(http://juddy.org/openmagic_solaris.jpg)
From a README:
Won't run on Solaris X86.
http://freshmeat.net/projects/openmagic/
(http://juddy.org/openmagic_solaris.jpg)
From a README:
Quote
LuBu OpenMagic 1.0 is a heavily modified version of the Lighthouse OpenStep 1.1
release for the Sparc platform. It is not a theme, nor a reconfiguration, but
an almost pure rewrite of non-binary files (runtime configurations, application
definitions, enviroment variables, and many functions). In some parts entire functions
have been replaced features have been added.
Won't run on Solaris X86.
Title: LuBu OpenMagic: Openstep 1.1 on Solaris 10
Post by: nextchef on October 22, 2006, 04:31:06 PM
Post by: nextchef on October 22, 2006, 04:31:06 PM
So how does it perform? How well does it run original NS/OS apps?
Does this have the same processor limitations as NS/OS, or can I run it on newer hardware than the SS10/5/20 line. The docs are not very specific on that point, but it may be obvious to someone more "in the know" concerning Sun machines.
Chef
Does this have the same processor limitations as NS/OS, or can I run it on newer hardware than the SS10/5/20 line. The docs are not very specific on that point, but it may be obvious to someone more "in the know" concerning Sun machines.
Chef
Title: LuBu OpenMagic: Openstep 1.1 on Solaris 10
Post by: itomato on October 22, 2006, 10:14:28 PM
Post by: itomato on October 22, 2006, 10:14:28 PM
So far so good..
I haven't had much opportunity to work with it yet, and there aren't all that many Openstep apps for Solaris. Preview works OK.. Preferences is kind of buggy, but it's nice to have Workspace Manager!!
The "feel" is different. It's not like a NeXT machine at all. It's as if GNUStep (GWorkspace, etc) were re-implemented with Motif.. They call Solaris "Slowaris" for a good reason..
The weirdness of it could be due to my hardware (440MHz, and running in 256 colors right now..)
I don't think there are any hardware limitations/ requirements. The newer Sparc machines running Solaris 10 might run LuBu.
It would be nice if Solaris 8 was a good bit nippier, and LuBu would still run..
I haven't had much opportunity to work with it yet, and there aren't all that many Openstep apps for Solaris. Preview works OK.. Preferences is kind of buggy, but it's nice to have Workspace Manager!!
The "feel" is different. It's not like a NeXT machine at all. It's as if GNUStep (GWorkspace, etc) were re-implemented with Motif.. They call Solaris "Slowaris" for a good reason..
The weirdness of it could be due to my hardware (440MHz, and running in 256 colors right now..)
I don't think there are any hardware limitations/ requirements. The newer Sparc machines running Solaris 10 might run LuBu.
It would be nice if Solaris 8 was a good bit nippier, and LuBu would still run..
Title: LuBu OpenMagic: Openstep 1.1 on Solaris 10
Post by: nextchef on October 23, 2006, 02:15:51 PM
Post by: nextchef on October 23, 2006, 02:15:51 PM
Quote from: "itomato"So far so good..
I haven't had much opportunity to work with it yet, and there aren't all that many Openstep apps for Solaris. Preview works OK.. Preferences is kind of buggy, but it's nice to have Workspace Manager!!
The "feel" is different. It's not like a NeXT machine at all. It's as if GNUStep (GWorkspace, etc) were re-implemented with Motif.. They call Solaris "Slowaris" for a good reason..
The weirdness of it could be due to my hardware (440MHz, and running in 256 colors right now..)
I don't think there are any hardware limitations/ requirements. The newer Sparc machines running Solaris 10 might run LuBu.
It would be nice if Solaris 8 was a good bit nippier, and LuBu would still run..
That is unfortunate. I was excited about the possibility of getting the "look and feel" of NeXT, and being able to run newer apps like firefox, but if the "feel" is not right, then I do not know. What Sun system are you running it on? I have a SS5-170/24b running Solaris 2.6 that I could try it on, but would it be so slow to be unbearable.
Chef
Title: LuBu OpenMagic: Openstep 1.1 on Solaris 10
Post by: itomato on October 23, 2006, 05:12:44 PM
Post by: itomato on October 23, 2006, 05:12:44 PM
http://sunsolve.sun.com/handbook_pub/Systems/U10/spec.html
A 440MHz Ultra 10, 256MB RAM, onboard FrameBuffer.
I imagine optimizing the framebuffer settings will help, but it's no NeXT box. It doesn't have the interface-to-hardware integration that you can sense on a NeXT - even a mono slab..
A 440MHz Ultra 10, 256MB RAM, onboard FrameBuffer.
I imagine optimizing the framebuffer settings will help, but it's no NeXT box. It doesn't have the interface-to-hardware integration that you can sense on a NeXT - even a mono slab..
Title: LuBu OpenMagic: Openstep 1.1 on Solaris 10
Post by: dlundh on May 04, 2007, 03:53:46 PM
Post by: dlundh on May 04, 2007, 03:53:46 PM
In the " don't knock it till you tried it"-department I installed Solaris 8 on an Ultra 10 and proceeded to install OpenMagic.
First of all, it IS OpenStep, which is nice. Second, just having the option to ditch CDE and OpenWindows is a huge, huge benefit. And being able to run straight up Solaris binaries intermixed with OpenStep is yummy.
I'd say the "look" part of look & feel is spot on. Where it falls apart is on the "feel" side of things. It is nowhere near as slick as OPENSTEP/Mach on Sparc and window behaviour is just plain wrong at times.
Still, it paints a pretty picture on Solaris and I much prefer it to CDE and OW - from now on I'm putting it on every Solaris system I manage - but a replacement for OPENSTEP/Mach it is not.
I have an Ultra 60 with a much nicer gfx card that I have started installing, come monday I'll know if the graphics feel snappier. Having faster gfx will, sadly, not do anything about the "feel" part though.
First of all, it IS OpenStep, which is nice. Second, just having the option to ditch CDE and OpenWindows is a huge, huge benefit. And being able to run straight up Solaris binaries intermixed with OpenStep is yummy.
I'd say the "look" part of look & feel is spot on. Where it falls apart is on the "feel" side of things. It is nowhere near as slick as OPENSTEP/Mach on Sparc and window behaviour is just plain wrong at times.
Still, it paints a pretty picture on Solaris and I much prefer it to CDE and OW - from now on I'm putting it on every Solaris system I manage - but a replacement for OPENSTEP/Mach it is not.
I have an Ultra 60 with a much nicer gfx card that I have started installing, come monday I'll know if the graphics feel snappier. Having faster gfx will, sadly, not do anything about the "feel" part though.
Title: LuBu OpenMagic: Openstep 1.1 on Solaris 10
Post by: kronoman on May 13, 2007, 03:48:45 PM
Post by: kronoman on May 13, 2007, 03:48:45 PM
Nice. Gotta play around with this. If I can get it to be sufficiently performant, it might displace XFCE or KDE as my Solaris DE of choice.
The other thing I wonder about is using pieces of this, but Window Maker as the WM. Not sure... Gotta try it!
I have a U10, U2 and soon a U60 to test this on, all have FFB cards. FFB2 for the U10, FFB1 (soon FFB2+) on the U2, and 2 FFB2+ for the U60.
The other thing I wonder about is using pieces of this, but Window Maker as the WM. Not sure... Gotta try it!
I have a U10, U2 and soon a U60 to test this on, all have FFB cards. FFB2 for the U10, FFB1 (soon FFB2+) on the U2, and 2 FFB2+ for the U60.
Title: LuBu OpenMagic: Openstep 1.1 on Solaris 10
Post by: helf on May 13, 2007, 05:26:05 PM
Post by: helf on May 13, 2007, 05:26:05 PM
slightly off topic...
I always wondered why people called slowlaris, slowlaris.. Now I know!
I finally bought a 13w3 to vga adapter and booted my ss20 up with sol8.. its slow as crap to load anything... and its a dual 75 supersparc with 256mb of ram.
I always wondered why people called slowlaris, slowlaris.. Now I know!
I finally bought a 13w3 to vga adapter and booted my ss20 up with sol8.. its slow as crap to load anything... and its a dual 75 supersparc with 256mb of ram.
Title: LuBu OpenMagic: Openstep 1.1 on Solaris 10
Post by: MacG4 on May 14, 2007, 04:02:00 PM
Post by: MacG4 on May 14, 2007, 04:02:00 PM
Quote from: "helf"slightly off topic...ive got the same sparc 20 setup
I always wondered why people called slowlaris, slowlaris.. Now I know!
I finally bought a 13w3 to vga adapter and booted my ss20 up with sol8.. its slow as crap to load anything... and its a dual 75 supersparc with 256mb of ram.
Title: LuBu OpenMagic: Openstep 1.1 on Solaris 10
Post by: Venture37 on August 18, 2007, 06:54:02 PM
Post by: Venture37 on August 18, 2007, 06:54:02 PM
I maxed out my dual 300mhz Ultra 2 with 2GB of RAM, solaris 8 now feels snappier!
Title: LuBu OpenMagic: Openstep 1.1 on Solaris 10
Post by: AStar617 on January 13, 2008, 03:33:23 PM
Post by: AStar617 on January 13, 2008, 03:33:23 PM
I may have to give this a try soon on some hardware with some more "oomph"...
(eyeing dual UltraSPARC-III+ 900MHz/8mb cache Sun Blade 2000 with 4gb RAM and 10k FC-AL disks :D)
(eyeing dual UltraSPARC-III+ 900MHz/8mb cache Sun Blade 2000 with 4gb RAM and 10k FC-AL disks :D)
Title: LuBu OpenMagic: Openstep 1.1 on Solaris 10
Post by: Venture37 on October 18, 2009, 10:27:30 AM
Post by: Venture37 on October 18, 2009, 10:27:30 AM
Just revisited the site again, looks like the developer hasn't taken the Oracle/Sun deal too well!
& finally
http://alge.anart.no/blogs/blog/2009/09/30/the-sum-of-it-all/
As much as it's nice to see a new member to the OpenBSD userbase, Is it really that bad?
QuoteSince Sun has been bought by Oracle, I am really not
sure if it is worth the effort. Porting to OpenSolaris
is not an option, and OpenMagic does not run on x8
QuotePowered by OpenBSD
& finally
http://alge.anart.no/blogs/blog/2009/09/30/the-sum-of-it-all/
As much as it's nice to see a new member to the OpenBSD userbase, Is it really that bad?
Title: LuBu OpenMagic: Openstep 1.1 on Solaris 10
Post by: roo on March 10, 2010, 08:17:22 AM
Post by: roo on March 10, 2010, 08:17:22 AM
Recently bought a Sun Ultra 60 with Solaris 10 and have installed OpenMagic and it's pretty impressive.
itomato mentioned in another topic (http://www.nextcomputers.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=13863&highlight=#13863) that some NS/OS software runs on Solaris OpenStep/OpenMagic.
Which apps work and which don't? I've tried a few from the files archive here but with no success, especially as lot are .pkg but Installer.app doesn't exist in OpenMagic.
itomato mentioned in another topic (http://www.nextcomputers.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=13863&highlight=#13863) that some NS/OS software runs on Solaris OpenStep/OpenMagic.
Which apps work and which don't? I've tried a few from the files archive here but with no success, especially as lot are .pkg but Installer.app doesn't exist in OpenMagic.
Title: Apps for OpenStep on SPARC
Post by: itomato on May 27, 2010, 08:08:08 PM
Post by: itomato on May 27, 2010, 08:08:08 PM
This sheds some light:
http://web.archive.org/web/19970607021252/http://www.eu.sun.com/solaris/products/openstep/sol-openstep-env/index.html
http://www.kevra.org/TheBestOfNext/NeXTProducts/NeXTSoftware/OpenStep-SolarisWhitePaper/files/page538_1.pdf
Basically, you're looking for OpenStep applications compiled for Solaris - as opposed to SPARC. Just as Windows NT had an OpenStep applications layer, an environment was available for Solaris.
You can set Solaris as a build target in Project Builder and build apps from source, if it's possible for the apps you want to use. Not many apps were built for Solaris, or OSE on Windows, unfortunately.
Here is one: JavaPlan (http://nextstuff.info/mirrors/ftp.funet.fi/pub/NeXT/Commercial/Lighthouse/JavaPlan/).
---
To go slightly off-topic, I believe it may be possible to run LuBu on an emulated SPARC with Qemu (http://tyom.blogspot.com/2009/12/solaris-under-qemu-how-to.html), if the single-user issue has been resolved...
...and, as the project author indicated, Sun's new owners may not be all that interested in archiving the project details of this type, (http://search.oracle.com/search/search?start=1&nodeid=&fid=&keyword=openstep&group=Oracle.com) so it may be a good idea to get what you need while you still can find it.
http://web.archive.org/web/19970607021252/http://www.eu.sun.com/solaris/products/openstep/sol-openstep-env/index.html
http://www.kevra.org/TheBestOfNext/NeXTProducts/NeXTSoftware/OpenStep-SolarisWhitePaper/files/page538_1.pdf
Basically, you're looking for OpenStep applications compiled for Solaris - as opposed to SPARC. Just as Windows NT had an OpenStep applications layer, an environment was available for Solaris.
You can set Solaris as a build target in Project Builder and build apps from source, if it's possible for the apps you want to use. Not many apps were built for Solaris, or OSE on Windows, unfortunately.
Here is one: JavaPlan (http://nextstuff.info/mirrors/ftp.funet.fi/pub/NeXT/Commercial/Lighthouse/JavaPlan/).
---
To go slightly off-topic, I believe it may be possible to run LuBu on an emulated SPARC with Qemu (http://tyom.blogspot.com/2009/12/solaris-under-qemu-how-to.html), if the single-user issue has been resolved...
...and, as the project author indicated, Sun's new owners may not be all that interested in archiving the project details of this type, (http://search.oracle.com/search/search?start=1&nodeid=&fid=&keyword=openstep&group=Oracle.com) so it may be a good idea to get what you need while you still can find it.
Title: LuBu OpenMagic: Openstep 1.1 on Solaris 10
Post by: StainlessSteelRat on May 28, 2010, 05:38:55 AM
Post by: StainlessSteelRat on May 28, 2010, 05:38:55 AM
hmmm, looks fun... I think I'll try firing it up on my sun blade 100. on a side note, has anyone know if it's possible to get ns/os x86 running on a sunpci card? think that might be a nice combination. last time I ran sun4m machine, I never pushed it past solaris 2.6... maybe 7 or 8 without X... slowlaris was traditionally used as an insult to non-smp x86 solaris, and it deserved it... sun4m seems pretty much like a i486ish(maybe pentium pro, in smp config) class machine, can't expect too much from most of them.
Title: SunPCi
Post by: itomato on May 28, 2010, 11:57:33 AM
Post by: itomato on May 28, 2010, 11:57:33 AM
Depending on your model card, maybe..
Some of them use a bunch of SiS chips, some have ESS and Intel, and most have an AMD processor, which itself shouldn't pose a problem.
The newer versions with mobile AMD processors and USB would be tricky, I think.
I have never used one, but I can imagine the SunOS-mediated floppy and hard disk interfaces layers to be a big hurdle.
Some of them use a bunch of SiS chips, some have ESS and Intel, and most have an AMD processor, which itself shouldn't pose a problem.
The newer versions with mobile AMD processors and USB would be tricky, I think.
I have never used one, but I can imagine the SunOS-mediated floppy and hard disk interfaces layers to be a big hurdle.
Title: LuBu OpenMagic: Openstep 1.1 on Solaris 10
Post by: roo on June 07, 2010, 08:52:39 AM
Post by: roo on June 07, 2010, 08:52:39 AM
Thanks itomato, I shall try my hand at building something from source :)
I've also been thinking about Openstep on the SunPCi as there is a 400 MHz card in my Ultra 60. I'll have a go when my second drive arrives this week.
I recently swapped out the single 360Mhz processor for 2 450Mhz and it's still not blistering, but Slowlaris has definitely sped up (a little). Now to max the RAM ...
I've also been thinking about Openstep on the SunPCi as there is a 400 MHz card in my Ultra 60. I'll have a go when my second drive arrives this week.
I recently swapped out the single 360Mhz processor for 2 450Mhz and it's still not blistering, but Slowlaris has definitely sped up (a little). Now to max the RAM ...
Title: LuBu OpenMagic: Openstep 1.1 on Solaris 10
Post by: StainlessSteelRat on June 10, 2010, 04:57:17 AM
Post by: StainlessSteelRat on June 10, 2010, 04:57:17 AM
yeah, the emulation for the cd and hard disk is a sticking point. installed a sunpci IIpro and found that it wasn't the simple sbc that I initially thought it was. I read in the linux install faq that there may be access to an onboard IDE controller... anyone know if any of the boards had accessible IDE ports or if anyone ever successfully used the ide headers on the board?
sadly, I wish OS would run on solaris x86/x64... my phenom nexenta machine runs so much faster than any other os I've had on it, that I believe the openstep apps would open seconds before I clicked on them. :)
sadly, I wish OS would run on solaris x86/x64... my phenom nexenta machine runs so much faster than any other os I've had on it, that I believe the openstep apps would open seconds before I clicked on them. :)
Title: Github
Post by: itomato on August 30, 2016, 10:29:25 AM
Post by: itomato on August 30, 2016, 10:29:25 AM
LuBu Openmagic 1.0 (1.1?) is up on GitHub now.
I exploded the tarball and pushed the files to a repo as insurance against bitrot.
https://github.com/itomato/lubu
I exploded the tarball and pushed the files to a repo as insurance against bitrot.
https://github.com/itomato/lubu
Title: Re: LuBu OpenMagic: Openstep 1.1 on Solaris 10
Post by: shogo2040 on July 23, 2019, 12:38:58 AM
Post by: shogo2040 on July 23, 2019, 12:38:58 AM
Is Project Builder and Interface Builder included?
Title: Re: LuBu OpenMagic: Openstep 1.1 on Solaris 10
Post by: isoriano on October 26, 2021, 02:39:04 PM
Post by: isoriano on October 26, 2021, 02:39:04 PM
Dear all,
so in 25 years not a single copy of WorkShop OpenStep for Solaris has seen the light? Maybe besides the SunSoft and Lighthouse folks it never left the Sun doors and the reason not a single (besides javaPlan) OpenStep Solaris application exists. What is really that bad? Else we may have been able to port most of the stuff till Rhapsody DR2 to Solaris :-)
It is such a nice environment on Solaris 10 U8.
Cheers
Iggi
so in 25 years not a single copy of WorkShop OpenStep for Solaris has seen the light? Maybe besides the SunSoft and Lighthouse folks it never left the Sun doors and the reason not a single (besides javaPlan) OpenStep Solaris application exists. What is really that bad? Else we may have been able to port most of the stuff till Rhapsody DR2 to Solaris :-)
It is such a nice environment on Solaris 10 U8.
Cheers
Iggi